What this argument is doing is presenting a metaphysical problem so it cannot be asserted pragmatically and Ethics is a response to a real problem. So it is true that "Society would crumble" and here comes the problem I was so frustrated about languages year ago, ambiguity. The society that the believer is talking about is their group and the society that the atheist is thinking is all human kind. In conclusion the Bible states that everybody is evil and also that only a few will be saved. Everyone sent to hell will be taken there for their sinful nature so there we see that it shows that Christians can live and survive and also receive blessings from God counting test as blessings too. Where's the trouble then ? Don't they believe faithfully in their Bible ?


Last year I encountered something and here's my proposed rebuttal; Society won't crumble because we can apply [Eupraxsophy][1], if your real concern is that then I suggest to read about that.

In general you just need to use a convincing argument for **you** because Christians are not rational about their belief and will only look for whatever comes at the top of their head when truth knocks hard at their minds. And that will only frustrate you since you will start sensing that they don't give a bubble's splash about what is real. Or you can just say : *Ok. I understand your concern, have peace. Talk to you later.*

And that's exactly what you are experiencing when someone says that blah blah central moral, ethics mumbo jumbo. Can you actually prove that in fact the moral system is what has some influence over society instead of a society agreeing to that system beforehand ? The answer is obvious, religions don't originate this ethics.

Clearly [Social Psychology][2] is what is moving forward on answering that.


  [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Kurtz#Eupraxsophy
  [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_psychology

**Origin of Ethics**

As a person raised in a Christian country and family I made those questions to myself. What is good and bad, I found that I make the "good" choices" because I am that way. And I challenge every christian with that reasoning to demonstrate that the source of their goodness is actually their belief and not their own good character.

By having a good character they feel identified with a belief that reinforces that goodness and they know as every well behaved person that we all loose our temper sometimes so religion is just a way to calm the concerns (among other things) of a normal human being about the evil inside or negative feelings that just happen in some emotionally stressful situations.

And this is why there are extreme Christians and decent Christians when they all read the same book.

[Wikipedia](http://tinyurl.com/zujl3xz)

**Ethics for all beings**

There have been a lot of religions and not all intended to be good, or didn't care about this things. But all religions share one thing and that is making a social construct. I have studied Christianity, Satanism, Gnosticism, Buddhism, Occultism, Rosicrucian and some Masonry. I have talked to members of all this during my life and interacted in a space of years.

Atheism is better because we are being honest about what we experience in life instead of stating that we are 100% sure that there is a divine entity somewhere.

Christians have tried a big number of approaches on objective minds and I stumble from time to time with them because this is a Christian country and many of my childhood friends are Christians.
[Wikipedia](http://tinyurl.com/kcfofth)